Good books

[civi68]

Just read books on Russia, Ukraine, and the Black Sea by Jens Muhling. He traveled to quite a few areas most foreigners have never visited. He experienced a lot of the FSU "logic" that many of us see while there. Worth checking them out.

[Trenchcoat]

Just read books on Russia, Ukraine, and the Black Sea by Jens Muhling. He traveled to quite a few areas most foreigners have never visited. He experienced a lot of the FSU "logic" that many of us see while there. Worth checking them out.

Thanks Civ, I've just put in an order for, 'Black Earth, A Journey Through Ukraine' by Jens Muhling. Looked the most appropriate one for me. The other two, the one on Russia and the one on the Black Sea less so for me. Despite present troubles I am intrigued to find out more about Ukraine.

Anyway, a good thought for a thread topic. My contribution at the moment if not already read is, Serhii Plokhy, 'The Gates of Europe: A History of Ukraine'. It delves into Ukraine's history all the way back to the early tribes and onwards through the different eras, a fascinating read and I think imperative to understanding the ethnicities of Ukraine and what has shaped Ukraine. About the right size book I thought on the subject, not too long and not too short.

On a separate note how is your search going for a FSW? A lot of Ukrainian girls abroad both in the US, UK, EU, etc at the moment. Also a lot of Russian girls who have sought asylum. Plenty of opportunities now right in your own doorstep. You may have to sift around but it could prove fruitful for you.

[2tallbill]

Russka by Edward Rutherford it's written like a James Michener novel.
Very entertaining. He writes about 2 fictional families and a fictional
town in Russia over  a period of 1800 years. You will learn the history. 
http://www.thriftbooks.com/w/russka-the-novel-of-russia-by-edward-rutherfurd/258658/#edition=2209891&idiq=4696092

I also recommend Poland by James Michener
http://www.thriftbooks.com/w/poland_james-a-michener/283168/?resultid=7cad4079-3ff5-4a88-9fb1-9f0d9f105cd4#edition=2148269&idiq=2561765

Thrift Books is about half the price of Amazon and you get hardcovers.

[ML]

Civ: 'Black Earth, A Journey Through Ukraine' by Jens Muhling.

Trench:  Serhii Plokhy, 'The Gates of Europe: A History of Ukraine'.

Thanks to Civ and Trench.

I just ordered both on ebay.  With taxes and free shipping, the costs were
Black Earth:  $7.73
Gates of Europe:  $6.32

Note:  There are 3 or more unrelated books that start with 'Black Earth.'

[civi68]

I haven't been looking for a while. I was thinking about getting back into it in the fall. Just haven't been that motivated to get married at age 56. FSU dating was my life in my 30's and I loved it. Other good books out there are, "Putin Country", "Midnight in Siberia," Black Square Adventures in Post Soviet Ukraine," "Black Earth A Journey Through Russia After the Fall," Fragile Empire How Russia Fell in and Out of Love with Vladimir Putin" "Bears in the Streets Three Journeys Across a Changing Russia," "Russia a Journey to the Heart of a Land and It's People," "Kremlin Rising."
   Good novels are the Martin Cruz Smith Arkady Renko series, the Nightwatch Series, "A Terrible Country" by Keith Gessen, "Snow Drops" and "Independence Square" by A.D. Miller, Nine Layers of Sky" by Liz Williams.

[Trenchcoat]

I haven't been looking for a while. I was thinking about getting back into it in the fall. Just haven't been that motivated to get married at age 56. FSU dating was my life in my 30's and I loved it. Other good books out there are, "Putin Country", "Midnight in Siberia," Black Square Adventures in Post Soviet Ukraine," "Black Earth A Journey Through Russia After the Fall," Fragile Empire How Russia Fell in and Out of Love with Vladimir Putin" "Bears in the Streets Three Journeys Across a Changing Russia," "Russia a Journey to the Heart of a Land and It's People," "Kremlin Rising."
   Good novels are the Martin Cruz Smith Arkady Renko series, the Nightwatch Series, "A Terrible Country" by Keith Gessen, "Snow Drops" and "Independence Square" by A.D. Miller, Nine Layers of Sky" by Liz Williams.

Interesting updated and thanks for the extra heads up on the other books to look at Civ. I know what you mean, I'm about a decade younger than you are and I think to myself if I was much older I probably wouldn't be that motivated to do the whole marriage and formal relationship thing. If I were single in my mind fifties I would probably be content to have my life as it is as a single guy and just date for enjoyment out that way. Not saying you can't date and enjoy it with marriage in mind of course but living with someone else permanently comes with adapting to each others life if course. With some girls easier than others and it can come with adding interest to your life in them being able to add a new dimension to your life. However, sometimes if you get in a place where you're happy enough with the life just the way you like it and doing fancy it being changed much then just going out there and dating for fun isn't a bad deal.

Things aren't great in Ukraine right now with electricity down to 20 percent or less through a lot of the country, men being hauled of the streets, high food & rent prices and discontent on the streets not to mention bombs falling randomly out of the skies. An adventure for some but potentially life alteringly dangerous. Moldova is a good viable alternative and for those not wishing to brave Ukraine that would be where I would be suggesting.

[Trenchcoat]

Thanks to Civ and Trench.

I just ordered both on ebay.  With taxes and free shipping, the costs were
Black Earth:  $7.73
Gates of Europe:  $6.32

Note:  There are 3 or more unrelated books that start with 'Black Earth.'

I am happy that you were able to find interest in them ML, you've got them for a great price there. I'm surprised you haven't got the Gates of Europe one already it's a great book and lovely to read all about the early tribes in the area and the stories about them right through the history of the area up to present day. It gave a great insight into Ukraine I enjoyed reading it a lot.

Well I don't have a lot else other than that, I got a travel guide to Ukraine while in Lviv. It was interesting enough and I may get around to posting a few pages from it up here. General stuff but a few interesting bits I didn't know about Ukraine. Other than that there is this one, a bit expensive at £75 or so and probably not worth the price. It's a photo book of old Ukrainian village houses, interesting but at that price and with half the pages being blank with a couple of words on I don't think worth the high asking price, they have done a website fir the book here and they list it in eBay (UK Site):

http://chytomo.com/en/old-khata-book-looking-for-a-place-called-home/

They have an Instagram page so more might be seen there anyway and I think the website gives and interesting insight into it. I personally don't think it's likely of a lot of value as likely a lot of old wooden village houses painted up but it might be of interest to some.

[civi68]

Interest in marriage does change for some as we get older. I just can't see myself taking the financial risk of divorce, particularly since I saved enough to end the rat race of working full time. I never want to return to full time work.

[ML]

Interest in marriage does change for some as we get older. I just can't see myself taking the financial risk of divorce, particularly since I saved enough to end the rat race of working full time. I never want to return to full time work.

Good logic.  Get yourself a live in girlfriend.

But only keep the same one less than 7 years; elsewise you can get caught in a common law marriage.

Laws probably are different in various states.

[Trenchcoat]

Interest in marriage does change for some as we get older. I just can't see myself taking the financial risk of divorce, particularly since I saved enough to end the rat race of working full time. I never want to return to full time work.

That I can very well understand. I wouldn't see much point or wish to get married when you can have a relationship without with no strings attached. Marriage I think is fine if wanting children but is an unnecessary bind often if not wanting children, fine for those that want it but without children I wouldn't. Children in themselves can mean a bit more time at the coalface, it's ok for me and possibly even guys in their fifties if it's really something they feel they have a real want to do. Most women that guys can get in their fifties are usually getting to or past the age where children are a possibility. In that respect the scales tip against the women in terms of men wanting to get with them as in a marriage. A marriage then becomes a big negative unless she is just as wealthy if not more so. After all few guys wish to expose the comfortable position they've made for themselves by chancing it with a woman only to be possibly in a bad place a few years hence. For a guy in his fifties who is unattached it's better to go out and meet FSW for fun and short term relationships. Enjoy the differences of the women you could meet and the relaxed nature of a short term relationship with no strings attached. Good times I reckon could be had out in Moldova now for a western guy who is comfortably off in life.

[civi68]

I would take a live in girlfriend and would have loved if this option was ever available with FSU women. Divorce is dramatically increasing among retired people. I guess decades of being together and then having to spend even more time together in retirement is the breaking point.
   On my last trip in 2012 (wow, it's been that long), I was meeting for the 2nd time with a woman with an adult daughter with child. One of the sticking points that she dropped on me for any visa was that I would have to take care of her adult daughter while she was in Ukraine. That meant rent, food, everything. And then, eventually have the daughter and child live with us. Needless to say, that changed any plans I was considering. I just thought how much could go wrong with having another adult with a child living in my home. So, this is something many of us older guys have to consider.

[ML]

One of the sticking points that she dropped on me for any visa was that I would have to take care of her adult daughter while she was in Ukraine. That meant rent, food, everything. And then, eventually have the daughter and child live with us. Needless to say, that changed any plans I was considering. I just thought how much could go wrong with having another adult with a child living in my home.

This would have meant an immediate 'drop' for me.

But then I am up for changing circumstances beyound control.

For instance, with the Russian terrorist invasion, we are now sending tons of money monthly to wife's relatives in Ukraine for their own care and to give to those they know in the military.

[Trenchcoat]

I would take a live in girlfriend and would have loved if this option was ever available with FSU women. Divorce is dramatically increasing among retired people. I guess decades of being together and then having to spend even more time together in retirement is the breaking point.
   On my last trip in 2012 (wow, it's been that long), I was meeting for the 2nd time with a woman with an adult daughter with child. One of the sticking points that she dropped on me for any visa was that I would have to take care of her adult daughter while she was in Ukraine. That meant rent, food, everything. And then, eventually have the daughter and child live with us. Needless to say, that changed any plans I was considering. I just thought how much could go wrong with having another adult with a child living in my home. So, this is something many of us older guys have to consider.

Divorce when at or near retirement is a difficult one. Sometimes just one partner wants divorce sometimes both. Where just one wants it the other night feel they are being deserted. The one partner or both partners that want it may see it as a chance to spend the latter years of their life really doing something more than just vegetation in the fear of being lonely, single, etc. By the time any children have grown up for some they have achieved something they really wanted to do but now want something new, a new life, etc with the years they have left. On the other hand some are happy to stay together either to vegetate or find something new together or because they still live each others company, etc.

The worst I feel for are those where one partner is ditched who doesn't want to as that can no doubt be hard and scary for many. Even the one partner that wants a divorce to have a new life it's not always easy as they will have to deal with the guilt and feelings of the other who it might seem they are deserting. Some stay friends and still spend time together of course which can be nice but also have their new life also perhaps. Some partners of course don't care much about the other after they have spent a large part of their kids with them and just want to move on whatever.


I can see why the woman said what she did about her daughter. Odds are the daughter relied upon the Mother for financial assistance. In that case would say it's fine giving financial assistance if you would be asking the woman to give her ability to give that assistance herself by moving to you. It's often difficult for Ukrainians, etc to find work abroad but if she did then of course she could assist her daughter herself. So long as there isn't any taking the pee with large sums beyond what is reasonably required I would say it is ok. The whole daughter with child in the house depends on what you are comfortable with or can get comfortable with. Any relationship is likely to mean sins kind of adjustment, LTR moreso. On the plus side you could have been tucked in bed with two for almost the price of one, the Mother and the Daughter

[Trenchcoat]

The, 'Black Earth, A Journey Through Ukraine' arrived yesterday. I went off a new copy off Amazon for £8.70 hard cover version. Seemed a good deal as only about 50p or so more than the paperback version. Looks nicely presented when it arrived. Saw inside it is usually/supposed to retail at £16.99 so not a bad bug I thought for a hard cover.

What's inside as they say usually counts most though. Haven't gotten to reading any of it yet. Seems like it says a kind of recall of random dialogue with random people in random places in Ukraine. Will be interesting to see if I find any use in it. If not I'll probably either sell it on if possible or donate it. I'm guessing the hardback was being sold off cheap as possibly the subject didn't immediately have much pull/awareness with western readers.

[2tallbill]

The, 'Black Earth, A Journey Through Ukraine' arrived yesterday. I went off a new copy off Amazon for £8.70 hard cover version. Seemed a good deal as only about 50p or so more than the paperback version. Looks nicely presented when it arrived. Saw inside it is usually/supposed to retail at £16.99 so not a bad bug I thought for a hard cover.

What's inside as they say usually counts most though. Haven't gotten to reading any of it yet. Seems like it says a kind of recall of random dialogue with random people in random places in Ukraine. Will be interesting to see if I find any use in it. If not I'll probably either sell it on if possible or donate it. I'm guessing the hardback was being sold off cheap as possibly the subject didn't immediately have much pull/awareness with western readers.

After you read it you should give a short review for the forum

[2tallbill]

After you read it you should give a short review for the forum

You didn't pay the £ 0.65 late fee's for your library card? When will we get your book review?

[krimster2]

Ukraine sometimes play tricks on yur mind...
you can be thinking that yur in some poor and culturally backward part of the USA like Alabama - pronounced "Ala-bam-ee"

with a buncha weird white follks wanderin about
but then suddenly ya see some weird stuff, like old beggar men who hunt through the garbage bins
have their chests full of medals on victory day
but then gone the day after

if ya wanna be nice to "bum-ghee" ya put yur left overs all in a different plastic bag, not contaminated by garbage,
and they will freakin eat right there while rooting through the bin lookin for more, with an insane look on their face

if you wanted to be a Ukrainain writer
whatcha do is this:

you go down to the "Property Registration Office" and ya make friends with the sexretaries there by givin 'em gifts/grifts
and ya wait...

pretty soon a buncha frantic relatives will come runnin in at the same time
somebody's grandma died and all her children are rushin in to claim her real estate property for themselves
when they catch each other in the office, 100% a major fight will break-out which will get physical, sister against sister are usually the worst ones

this is a really really good source of dramatic material about the subjects of greed and anger

other stuff you'll see:

a man who forces his blind daughter to play the violin and beg for money
who publicly berates her and slaps her when she doesn't get enough

dead alchoholics I passed taking my daughter to school in the dead of winter
and picking up the syringes in the playground on my way back home

for some Russians, death in Ukraine isn't any worse than life in Russia
and that's why they're not opposed to the war
plus soldiers can buy a SHITELOAD of vodka!!!!
that and some potatos and bread, a warm place to sheet, and ya pretty much got a happy Russian (salo+pepper, onion)

unfortunately, for Russians
they "ate their own dog food"
i.e. believed their own propaganda of the superiority of the Russian "reformed criminal" soldier
kino is not reality, but to Russians the kino is more important than reality

and this is the root cause of Russian faiilure
they've lost all touch with this thing called "reality"

Putin thinks Russia can only be redeemed by it's suffering
the end of next year there will be over 1,000,000 Russian casualties

if Czarist Russia had held on for another 2 years, it would have won the war with Germany, and might not have collapsed

the only question is this:
will it be a continuous war?
or will there be a temporary truce before PArt II starts after Putin has rearmed

if Putin takes Ukraine,
how long before Ukraine takes Georgia and Moldova?



money talks
russian bullshit walks and then falls out a window

they're a "simple" people
and not like "regular" white people in the USA, etc...

we have less than 20 years to prepare for WWIII
when I say "we", I really mean just you....


meanwhile, it's just a matter of time until killer drones start showin up EVERYWHERE
and if you think FPV drone/flying bombs are "RADICAL"
think what will exist 20 years from now

we already have driverless cars "Waymo" that COULD carry a 1,000 lb load of high explosive to any GPS coordinate
imagine what they could be carryin 20 years from now
who needs missiles and submarines????

warehouses full of driverless cars each one carrying a tactical nuetron bomb that we knew how to make 40 years ago
one mega-factory makes the bombs
and another mega-factory makes the driverless cars

of course, if ya don't wanna go "nuke"
you can always substitute Novichok or Anthrax or even Russian Bio-War Smallpox

if you have a really good RNA Vaccine production capability
you could immunize your population to a bio-weapon you unleash on the rest of the world

think of it as you apply mosquito repellant to yur people, but not the enemy
and the mosquitos carry malaria

Bio-War
it's just another form of a war of attrition, like the one Putin is already fighting...